From mru at inprovide.com  Fri Dec 17 13:44:17 2004
From: mru at inprovide.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?M=E5ns_Rullg=E5rd?=)
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 13:44:17 +0100
Subject: [libdca-devel] patent claims
Message-ID: <yw1xmzwdayce.fsf@ford.inprovide.com>

Has anyone done any further investigation regarding the claims of DTS
Inc?

There are some little bugs and glitches I'd lend a hand in fixing, but
it seems like a waste of time if we are not allowed to distribute the
code.

-- 
M?ns Rullg?rd
mru at inprovide.com

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From gbazin at videolan.org  Wed Dec 22 14:11:40 2004
From: gbazin at videolan.org (Gildas Bazin)
Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 14:11:40 +0100
Subject: [libdca-devel] Re: patent claims
In-Reply-To: <yw1xmzwdayce.fsf@ford.inprovide.com>
References: <yw1xmzwdayce.fsf@ford.inprovide.com>
Message-ID: <200412221411.40990.gbazin@videolan.org>

On Friday 17 December 2004 13:44, M?ns Rullg?rd wrote:
> Has anyone done any further investigation regarding the claims of DTS
> Inc?
> 

I'm not involved in the negotiations between the ECP (the school 
hosting/managing the VideoLAN project) and DTS Inc. so don't take my answer 
as the official version of what's going on.

DTS Inc. sent a threat letter to the ECP asking them to stop distributing 
libdts which they say infringes on their patent. And they do indeed own a 
patent on DTS Coherent Acoustics.
For the European version (which was apparently granted on 2004/10/13), see: 
http://v3.espacenet.com/textdoc?DB=EPODOC&IDX=CN1208489&F=0&RPN=EP0864146&DOC=deb45b02a96927e0985109c18941e8b85f&QPN=EP0864146

The patent might be challengeable (at least for the decoder side) because it 
doesn't describe any invention as such but more a format of data (remember 
the infamous M$ patent on the ASF format ?).

However as everybody knows, it is a lengthy and expensive process to try to 
challenge (even a bogus) patent so I don't really expect the ECP will take 
this route.

There were also talks about getting a license from DTS Inc. but I don't 
think this will play well with the GPL anyway.

All in all it doesn't look too good to me, and even if the ECP decides to 
challenge the patent, it will take an awful long time before we can 
distribute libdca again.

>
> There are some little bugs and glitches I'd lend a hand in fixing, but
> it seems like a waste of time if we are not allowed to distribute the
> code.
> 

Yeah, that really is a shame.

--
Gildas

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From mru at inprovide.com  Wed Dec 22 21:40:07 2004
From: mru at inprovide.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?M=E5ns_Rullg=E5rd?=)
Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 21:40:07 +0100
Subject: [libdca-devel] Re: patent claims
In-Reply-To: <200412221411.40990.gbazin@videolan.org> (Gildas Bazin's
 message of "Wed, 22 Dec 2004 14:11:40 +0100")
References: <yw1xmzwdayce.fsf@ford.inprovide.com>
	<200412221411.40990.gbazin@videolan.org>
Message-ID: <yw1xekhiqd7c.fsf@ford.guide>

Gildas Bazin <gbazin at videolan.org> writes:

> On Friday 17 December 2004 13:44, M?ns Rullg?rd wrote:
>> Has anyone done any further investigation regarding the claims of DTS
>> Inc?
>> 
>
> I'm not involved in the negotiations between the ECP (the school 
> hosting/managing the VideoLAN project) and DTS Inc. so don't take my answer 
> as the official version of what's going on.
>
> DTS Inc. sent a threat letter to the ECP asking them to stop distributing 
> libdts which they say infringes on their patent. And they do indeed own a 
> patent on DTS Coherent Acoustics.
> For the European version (which was apparently granted on 2004/10/13), see: 
> http://v3.espacenet.com/textdoc?DB=EPODOC&IDX=CN1208489&F=0&RPN=EP0864146&DOC=deb45b02a96927e0985109c18941e8b85f&QPN=EP0864146
>
> The patent might be challengeable (at least for the decoder side) because it 
> doesn't describe any invention as such but more a format of data (remember 
> the infamous M$ patent on the ASF format ?).

Are software patents valid at all in Europe?

> However as everybody knows, it is a lengthy and expensive process to try to 
> challenge (even a bogus) patent so I don't really expect the ECP will take 
> this route.
>
> There were also talks about getting a license from DTS Inc. but I don't 
> think this will play well with the GPL anyway.

Something is still better than nothing, IMHO.

> All in all it doesn't look too good to me, and even if the ECP decides to 
> challenge the patent, it will take an awful long time before we can 
> distribute libdca again.

Could it be distributed from some other country instead?

>> There are some little bugs and glitches I'd lend a hand in fixing, but
>> it seems like a waste of time if we are not allowed to distribute the
>> code.
>
> Yeah, that really is a shame.

I notice the svn repository is still accessible if I use my password.
Still not much point committing changes, though, and it might not be a
good idea to do so either.

-- 
M?ns Rullg?rd
mru at inprovide.com

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